Trump Pulled Off the ‘Greatest Grift in U.S. History'

[dorankj]

Can we shoot anyone who “storms” a place they are not supposed to be? Why was she the ONLY person shot that day? (By a uniformed police officer, don’t we expect better from them?) I notice you’re not comparing to Kyle now, that’s good if you see how different those cases are (my bigger point earlier). I’m more trying to point out our media and ‘elites’ politics, hypocrisy and bias and work toward us regular people not being completely stuck in the ‘team sport’ version everything in our world takes on.

[Fun CH]

The fact that you’re trying to equalize these two very different cases and the way you are shows you really don’t know much about either case and probably can’t risk the narrative being questioned to investigate more! Maybe you should expand your news sources and get clearer understanding of each of these cases. You normally dig very hard and find reputable info for the question asked and the point you’re making, suddenly you’re very vague and circumspect. There is really no comparison here, the dirtbags Kyle shot I honestly won’t lose any sleep over even though I agree Kyle was a dumb kid who shouldn’t have brought a gun (but very much acted in self defense). I can find so little Ashley did wrong even if you hate her politics that would deserve her being murdered by a police officer. At this point you’re only furthering why there is such a divide in this country. IMHO

Are you saying Ashley didn't storm the capitol with the rest of that angry mob?

Enlighten me as to your source on this matter?

Hate is a strong word, Ken, I disagree with some of the Trump party politics, not all.

I agree we shouldn't police the world though military force and install puppet governments that serve our agenda. I agree we shouldn't do business with China, but not to the point of vilifying the Chinese people.

I agree people have the right to own an AR15 with proper background checks and a gun safety course.

I believe people have the right to get the covid vaccine or not but I also believe in employer's right to require that vaccine for workplace safety if that employee is around others.

So I think you're making some assumptions about my politics.

And how exactly is having a civil discussion about politics and factual events divisive?

Fairly quick to brand that divisive label on me, me thinks.

[dorankj]

The fact that you’re trying to equalize these two very different cases and the way you are shows you really don’t know much about either case and probably can’t risk the narrative being questioned to investigate more! Maybe you should expand your news sources and get clearer understanding of each of these cases. You normally dig very hard and find reputable info for the question asked and the point you’re making, suddenly you’re very vague and circumspect. There is really no comparison here, the dirtbags Kyle shot I honestly won’t lose any sleep over even though I agree Kyle was a dumb kid who shouldn’t have brought a gun (but very much acted in self defense). I can find so little Ashley did wrong even if you hate her politics that would deserve her being murdered by a police officer. At this point you’re only furthering why there is such a divide in this country. IMHO

[Fun CH]

So why exactly did he need to shoot her? She was unarmed, pretty small had no other weapons wasn’t even the only one around and not the first through. So why does a officer, with a history of failure to properly secure his weapon shoot an unarmed woman veteran and no one else? And gets in no trouble for it? It is DEFINITELY nothing like the Rittenhouse case, a 17 yo attacked repeatedly. The media lies and cover-up are consistent, wrong narrative. Again, journalism would be great.

why did Rittenhouse shoot an unarmed man who earlier threw a plastic bag at him and some verbal abuse?

I can't answer those questions.

I only know some of the facts like none of the house members were harmed by that angry violent mob yelling hang Mike Pence as they stormed the Capital.

Close, but no cigar.

[dorankj]

So why exactly did he need to shoot her? She was unarmed, pretty small had no other weapons wasn’t even the only one around and not the first through. So why does a officer, with a history of failure to properly secure his weapon shoot an unarmed woman veteran and no one else? And gets in no trouble for it? It is DEFINITELY nothing like the Rittenhouse case, a 17 yo attacked repeatedly. The media lies and cover-up are consistent, wrong narrative. Again, journalism would be great.

[Fun CH]

I’m pretty sure she came in through a broken window, there’s video of it. I really don’t find NBC any sort of credible source especially on this subject and your link proves that (no critical journalism there!)

the video I saw was the angry mob breaking into to the house chamber shots fired and her lying outside the chamber door. That consistent with that officer's testimony.

Don't really care much about what the journalist had to say just what the person who did the shooting had to say, which I posted.

When you think about it, it's really similar to The Rittenhouse case only the officer was doing his duty to defend and protect house members as well as himself and fellow officers, which he did.

Of course I could be wrong. Sometimes a person dressed in a gorilla suit passes by through a busy basketball court and many don't remember they saw it.

Our bias can play funny tricks with our memory.

[dorankj]

I’m pretty sure she came in through a broken window, there’s video of it. I really don’t find NBC any sort of credible source especially on this subject and your link proves that (no critical journalism there!)

[Fun CH]

I’m not very good at the video clip game, now do Ashley Babbit. Who killed her, why and why isn’t the story known? I don’t defend any of those people or Trump really regarding this issue but the truth and context DOES matter!

Lt. Michael Byrd defending 60 or so members of Congress who were still in the chamber when the shooting occurred.

"Once we barricaded the doors, we were essentially trapped where we were,” Byrd said in an exclusive interview with NBC News’ Lester Holt, speaking publicly for the first time since the riot. “There was no way to retreat. No other way to get out.

“If they get through that door, they’re into the House chamber and upon the members of Congress,” added Byrd, who gave NBC News permission to use his name after authorities had declined to release it."

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/of ... e-n1277736

[dorankj]

I’m not very good at the video clip game, now do Ashley Babbit. Who killed her, why and why isn’t the story known? I don’t defend any of those people or Trump really regarding this issue but the truth and context DOES matter!

[Fun CH]

Trump has finally admitted that he didn't win the election.

"Donald Trump has told Fox News he “didn’t win” the 2020 presidential election, and wishes Joe Biden well.

New York grand jury stores up trouble for Trump Organization executives
The former president made the admission seven months after the election was called for his rival and five months after Biden’s inauguration, during a rambling phone interview with Fox show host Sean Hannity on Wednesday night.

He did not drop his lie that the Democrat won thanks to electoral fraud.

“We were supposed to win easily, 64m votes,” Trump said. “We got 75m votes and we didn’t win, but let’s see what happens on that.”"

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/202 ... -joe-biden

[pasayten]

Jan 6th...

https://youtu.be/m26mFKKJyZU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhjRXO72v1s

https://youtu.be/270F8s5TEKY

[dorankj]

Yes (I barely notice the dripping condescension!)

[PAL]

Ok, you didn't. David did mention it in the 4 scenarios. So you are right about that. Do you think the majority of people there were Antifa? Do you think it was a peaceful entering of the Capitol building that day?
Oh, I don't go around thinking, gee, I'm smart, Ken is not. But I know facts and right from wrong.
Are you smart enough to know the facts that happened that day?

[dorankj]

I didn’t say a single word about “Antifa”! Maybe you’re not as smart as you think?

[PAL]

Ken,ok, so we agree to this. There is corruption in our government. So let's get the corporate influence out of it. And maybe that needs a revolution. But, no doubt about it, the Trump organization is also Wall Street and was/is corrupt.
It was not mostly peaceful! And no it was not mostly antifa as you would like to believe. It was violent, with blood being shed. Heads being bashed in. Some of the police went along with it. The majority did not. They were overwhelmed by an angry mob incited by months of build up by a "leader" that fired them up. And then watched on the TV for a couple of hours maybe more, with his darling Ivanka finally persuading him to do something. And he said he loved them all. How nice.
How long are you going to keep dragging Clinton into this? She is way in the past, as is Obama.
What happened last year, is much more recent. Trumps cronies-see what their crimes are. Many members, not just one or two.
I am not going to be influenced and say that it was a peaceful protest. May have started out that way, but the end result was not. So it that makes me smarter, thanks.
Last sentence is true, but has been overused.

[dorankj]

Well here is some of the inconvenient truth you leave out, no one has been charged with armed insurrection, the only person killed was an unarmed small woman killed by a capital police officer who has faced NO accountability, many protesters were let in by police (why was security not upped by Pelosi?). It was literally the worst “insurrection” in history which may make it more of a (mostly peaceful lol) protest in the ‘people’s house’. When your side goes so over the top (Russia, Russia, impeach, impeach) and don’t really honestly evaluate the whole story and truth you lose credibility and people won’t respond to the next sky is falling cries (which unfortunately leads to more screaming for attention!)

[mister_coffee]

Yes, I remember when Clinton supporters stormed the capitol...

The problem, Ken is that on one side there is one story:

(1) Trump supporters stormed the capitol to overturn the election, shouting "Hang Mike Pence" and getting at least two people killed, including one police officer and one rioter.

But on the right-wing side of the story, we have several narratives:

(1) It was all a false-flag operation by Antifa and Black Lives Matter.
(2) It was all a false-flag operation by the Deep State.
(3) It was a peaceful protest and all of the violence was staged or fake.
(4) It was a justifiable violent action to prevent election theft.

It seems to me that reality and truth are usually pretty easy to keep track of, and the fact that there are multiple narratives attempting to explain away the events of January 6th are a clear sign that the terrorist cult members on the right know they screwed up and are trying to cover their tracks.

I find it interesting that with all of the BLM violence in the summer of 2020 (and there was a lot of violence) nobody from that side of the fence feels compelled to explain it away as fake or a false flag operation. Yet the girly men on the right don't have it in them to own up to their own actions. Which isn't surprising to me, as we always knew that bullies and terrorists are cowards.

[dorankj]

Everything you two say is exactly said by the other side, the names change to Clinton, Obama, Holder, Emanuel, Soros, Maddow, Lemon, CNN, MSNBC. Do you think you’re immune from the same issues? Are you so superior, smarter, unable to be influenced? ‘Stupid is full of confidence and intelligence has doubts’

[PAL]

Great points Rideback.
Here is what has been going on for many years, in some factions of the Republican party, not just the Trump admin. but it had gotten worse with his regime. That is, if a lie is repeated often enough people, not very bright people or maybe even bright people that should know better, start believing it.
People are screaming about Trump because they are angry about what he and his cronies tried to do, Ken, if that is what you mean by screaming about it.
What's not failing is the current admin. is not trying to deconstruct our democracy.

[Rideback]

I have a good friend who starts every conversation with 'everyone is entitled to their opinion'. Ok. The problem with that arises in how you formed that opinion. Did you find that opinion through talking with other friends, through listening and watching like minded media that talks to you with only their opinion?

Did you reach your opinion by watching you tubes of more people talking at you with things that sound pretty reasonable but they don't give you resources, because they can't link to specific studies or whatever on you tube?

The trouble with opinions is that sooner or later they bend towards bias. Your bias, my bias, more things that I want to see that confirm my bias is right. That's why it's referred to as 'confirmation bias'. And confirmation bias messaging is a key into how anyone can be influenced. Just give me a nugget of truth to get my attention and then roll in the opinions telling me what's happening and I'm hooked.

This is how opinions dilute the truth and eventually reality. This is how con men work. This is how Trump, Miller, Flynn, Manafort, Alex Jones, Roger Stone, Tucker Carlson, Sean Hannity and their ilk work. They've all made fortunes off of confirmation bias opinions. They still are.

There's more 1/6 insurrectionists going to court this week to make plea deals. Rather than watch the confirmation bias talking heads give their opinions on all the court cases (and there's already been a whopping lot) it's probably a smarter thing to do to read the court papers themselves. That's when you see what happened through the insurrectionists' eyes. From the people who were suckered in to the people who carefully plotted and planned, the actual messages are in the court docs and there's no denying who orchestrated the day.

People who donated to Trump's campaign and to the RNC should know that the RNC is paying, still, much of Trump's mounting legal bills. That's where their money is going. Bannon never returned the money on the fake wall he promoted and got indicted for doing. Roger Stone has made mega bucks from his scams, Alex Jones has bragged he's been made a billionaire, Tucker Carlson & Sean Hannity have raked in the money. Odysee is making big crypto currency $ from it's promotions... So look not at what these guys are telling you to make you feel righteous, look at the money trail. It used to be that we could blame this on the Kochs, but in truth they just built the framework and that framework is still active but there's a whole lot of everyday people now who have jumped on board with $. Look at the Trump Teddy Bear being sold for $60 that you can hold to comfort yourself...

[dorankj]

You can believe what you want, it doesn’t make it true. Screaming it constantly also won’t make it true. But by all all means put all your thought and effort into Orange man (and any support) bad! Let’s go Brandon, and no Pearl it’s not a weak college chant. It was literally purposeful misinformation to try and protect the current POTUS and deny reality. The blatant hypocrisy and lying by our media and leaders that you so conveniently ignore now is why this effort is failing!

[PAL]

Exactly David.
So, Ken, we're supposed to be tolerant of a violent overthrow of our government?

[mister_coffee]

Well, technically not quite half of the country

And actually, I think it is reasonable to be intolerant of people who want to violently overthrow our democracy when their guy doesn't win. Which is exactly what happened last January 6th.

[dorankj]

So you detest half the country you live in, doesn’t seem very tolerant? Isn’t that what that side says they value most, and ‘progress’ (where exactly are we ‘progressing’ to? I’m not sure I want to go there!) Maybe take your own advice.

[SharonLaVonne]

Donald Trump was a con-artist, thief, liar and most disgusting presidential candidate in history, right from the start. I cannot understand why people didn't see him for what he was, a small-minded, selfish fool. My faith in my fellow Americas and the state of our democracy is at an all time low. Thanks, Ray, for a BB that allows a person say so. My pity for those who cannot see and understand truth about him. You are lost souls stuck in a web of lies. Please seek truth and knowledge even if you don't like it.